We Would Be Dead
A weekly true crime podcast that finds humanity in the darkness, humor in the history and the devil in the details.
Episodes

Wednesday Mar 15, 2023
War Widows and Wild Stallions (The Legend of Red Mary)
Wednesday Mar 15, 2023
Wednesday Mar 15, 2023
Greetings fiends, it’s time for our 2023 St. Patrick’s Day offering!
Every we find some wild Irish stories and folklore for you, so we can celebrate one of the most magical and terrifying places in folkloric history.
This year we have the legend of Red Mary. Hers is a story of love, war, revenge, violence, angry ghosts and a wild stallion. Get your whiskey ready and sit yourself by a cozy fire because this story is an adventure. Sláinte fiends, we hope you enjoy!
Click to learn more
Red Mary Irish Folklore
Wiki - Red Mary
The Last Leprechauns of Ireland - Kevin "McCoillte" Woods
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Wednesday Mar 08, 2023
Black Friday Widow (Omaima Nelson)
Wednesday Mar 08, 2023
Wednesday Mar 08, 2023
On December 2nd 1991,Costa Mesa CA police arrested 23 year old Egyptian former model Omaima Nelson for the murder of her 56 year old husband Bill. Omaima had confessed to a former boyfriend on December 1st when she showed up at his home with a suitcase of unidentifiable body parts.
Investigators were immediately sent to the Nelson residence, and while they didn’t expect the scene to be neat and tidy or even easy to stomach, they couldn't possibly have prepared themselves for what they found. It didn't look like a crime of passion had occurred, It looked like a cannibal’s test kitchen.
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Egypt UNFPA - FGM
World Health Organization - FGM
https://medium.com/california-dreaming/omaima-nelson-the-thanksgiving-butcher-2e21d300b328
https://www.ocregister.com/2011/10/06/woman-who-dismembered-husband-denied-parole/
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1991-12-03-me-526-story.html
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1993-01-13-mn-1395-story.html
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Thursday Mar 02, 2023
Brilliant and Terrible (Jolly Jane)
Thursday Mar 02, 2023
Thursday Mar 02, 2023
Jolly Jane Toppan was a bubbly nurse and caregiver who was know in the late 1800's Boston area for her extreme compassion and dedication to her patients. Jane was a natural fit to take care of the sick and elderly, as she was patient and always in a good mood. Her kind eyes, matronly appearance and jovial smile made Jane easy to trust and a breath of fresh air in the cold clinical light of a hospital, it was so nice to have a person as caring as Jane in their corner in what would often be the last moments of there life. Therein lied the problem for Jane, it seemed that more and more of her patients were winding up dead. By the time Jane was apprehended she confessed to over 30 murders though most suspect it could be more. Join us for this exploration a seldom discussed character in the true crime sphere, the serial killing woman.
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Original Newspaper Article
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Thursday Feb 23, 2023
To or From (The Disappearance of Asha Degree)
Thursday Feb 23, 2023
Thursday Feb 23, 2023
On Sunday February 13th 2000, 9 year old Asha Degree went to church, went home, spent the day with her family and went to bed on time. The next morning her mother opened her door at 6:30 am, expecting to see her sleepy 4th grader burrowed under her covers, instead she opened the door to find an empty bed, no sign anywhere in the house of Asha, and no one ever saw or heard from her again.
What tiny pieces of the story the police could uncover made little to no sense. It appeared, astonishingly, that Asha actually had run away. This is a highly unusual case, at just 9 years old we have to assume that Asha wasn't just trying to make her own way in the world, if she ran there had to be something or someone she was running to... or from.
If you have any information about Asha Degree, please call the tip line at (704) 672-6100 or the National Center for Missing & Exploited Children at 1-800-THE-LOST, that's 1-800-843-5678.
Click to learn more
https://www.actus-reus.com/asha-degree-timeline
https://www.fbi.gov/video-repository/inside-the-fbi-searching-for-asha-degree-021422.mp4/view
https://findingashadegree.wordpress.com/a-ashas-story-a-summary-of-circumstances/b-ashas-disappearance-the-timeline/
https://findingashadegree.wordpress.com/a-ashas-story-a-summary-of-circumstances/b-ashas-disappearance-the-timeline/
http://www.webbsleuths.com/cgi-bin/dcf/dcboard.cgi?az=printer_format&forum=MC&om=249&omm=8
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Thursday Feb 16, 2023
Strange Love (Penelope Jackson & Marlene Warren)
Thursday Feb 16, 2023
Thursday Feb 16, 2023
Fiends! We Would Be Dead has turned 3! In honor of our first episode "Gross Love" (and Valentines Day of course), we would like to offer you a strange and unusual story swap about love affairs gone wrong. Leslie brings us the story of Penelope Jackson, a lovely British Nana who simply had enough (Do NOT insult a woman's favorite side dish, it never ends well.) and Holly tells us the story of Florida's own killer clown. One might think Florida has seen many a killer clown, but no, just one. Here's to three years of fake short stories, true long stories, history, horror, humor, important lessons, fun facts and lots and lots of Validation. TOAST!
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999 Call between Penny Jackson and Dispatcher
BBC-Penny and David Jackson case
Daily Mail (Penny Jackson)
Penny Jackson's Confession note
Penny Jackson and her husbands
https://www.foxnews.com/us/inside-florida-killer-clown-murder-carnations-balloons-fatal-gunshot-focus-decades-old-case
https://abcnews.go.com/US/killer-clown-suspects-husband-insists-shes-falsely-accused/story?id=50536783
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5642465/Son-mother-shot-dead-killer-clown-1990-gives-emotional-interview.html
https://www.palmbeachpost.com/story/news/crime/2022/10/11/true-crime-clown-killer-wellington-florida-accused-marlene-warren-murder/8035633001/
https://www.local10.com/topic/Marlene_Warren/
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/2017/09/27/after-27-years-arrest-made-shooting-florida-clown/15774591007/
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Wednesday Feb 08, 2023
Exhumed (Alonzo Brooks Part 2)
Wednesday Feb 08, 2023
Wednesday Feb 08, 2023
On April 3, 2004, 23 year old Alonzo Brooks left his home in Gardner Kansas with three friends to attend a party. He said goodbye to his mother, Maria, and hopped into a friends car. This was the last time Alonzo’s mother would ever see him alive.
The next day when Alonzo hadn't returned home, Maria knew something was wrong, she contacted his friends and tried to retrace his steps to see where he could be. Instead of finding her son however, Maria discovered a tangled web of disjointed. It seems that Alonzo was left alone at a party an hour away with no car and no way to get home. After a month long police investigation turns up nothing, Alonzo's family organized their own search. Scarcely an hour into their search, in an area that had been cleared many times, Alonzo's family discovered his body. How does a person disappear without a trace, only to reappear a month later as if by magic, dead? We don't know, but one thing is for sure, there is more to this case than meets the eye.
Click to learn more
https://kansaspublicradio.org/local-news/2021-03-02/racist-history-still-haunts-hays-and-other-kansas-towns
https://www.hppr.org/hppr-news/2021-03-02/what-the-history-of-noose-road-tells-us-about-kansas-race-and-the-lynchings-of-black-men
https://timesmachine.nytimes.com/timesmachine/1993/11/20/431093.html?pageNumber=26
https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/06/us/alonzo-brooks-case-ruled-homicide-unsolved-mysteries-trnd/index.html
https://www.nbcnews.com/dateline/new-autopsy-report-reveals-2004-death-alonzo-brooks-was-homicide-n1263108
https://www.abhmuseum.org/sundown-towns-the-past-and-present-of-racial-segregation/
https://www.britannica.com/place/sundown-town
https://www.blackpast.org/african-american-history/marion-indiana-lynching-1930/
https://www.abhmuseum.org/an-iconic-lynching-in-the-north/
Cold Case Kansas Blog
Unsolved Mysteries
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Wednesday Feb 01, 2023
Stranded (Alonzo Brooks Part 1)
Wednesday Feb 01, 2023
Wednesday Feb 01, 2023
On April 3, 2004, 23 year old Alonzo Brooks left his home in Gardner Kansas with three friends to attend a party. He said goodbye to his mother, Maria, and hopped into a friends car. This was the last time Alonzo’s mother would ever see him alive.
The next day when Alonzo hadn't returned home, Maria knew something was wrong, she contacted his friends and tried to retrace his steps to see where he could be. Instead of finding her son however, Maria discovered a tangled web of disjointed. It seems that Alonzo was left alone at a party an hour away with no car and no way to get home. After a month long police investigation turns up nothing, Alonzo's family organized their own search. Scarcely an hour into their search, in an area that had been cleared many times, Alonzo's family discovered his body. How does a person disappear without a trace, only to reappear a month later as if by magic, dead? We don't know, but one thing is for sure, there is more to this case than meets the eye.
Click to learn more
Cold Case Kansas Blog
Unsolved Mysteries
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Wednesday Jan 25, 2023
Epitaph (Who Put Bella in the Wych Elm?)
Wednesday Jan 25, 2023
Wednesday Jan 25, 2023
On April 18th 1943 in Worcestershire England, (yes like the sauce no one can pronounce) 4 young boys looking for birds eggs crept into Hagley Wood. Hagley wood was a mysterious place. Located on the grounds of the partially abandoned Hagley Hall, Hagley woods were dotted with neglected temples and statues, overgrown landscaping and ancient stately trees. But one tree stood out among the rest. A tree almost entirely comprised of sharp, leafless twigs jutting out at severe angles, a gnarled, menacing, leafless wych elm. Most people would steer clear of such a thing, but the boys knew this kind of tree was the perfect place to hide nests. When they looked inside it's large and hollow trunk however, they didn't find birds, they didn't find eggs, they found a body, and unearthed a mystery that hangs over the village of Hagley to this very day. Who put Bella in the Wych Elm? This story may be familiar to some, but our dive is DEEP.
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From the Worcestershire county council
Josef Jakobs Blog
British Newspaper Archive, create a free account to see all original articles
Explore Hagley Hall
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Wednesday Jan 18, 2023
Discord (The Mishandled Murder of Bianca Devins)
Wednesday Jan 18, 2023
Wednesday Jan 18, 2023
Discord: D I S C O R D. A lack of agreement or harmony. A combination of sounds that strikes the ear harshly. Discord.
6:45 AM, on July 14th 2019. The eastern united states is beginning to wake up and scroll through their social media. The day was warm and sunny and a group of young adults in Utica New York was about to unwillingly witness a step by step account of a terrible murder.
After a series of cryptic posts on Instagram from the user @yesjuliet and similar posts on Discord from the user @aperatia, both accounts (same user) posted a picture of a beautiful young girl lying dead in his car. The user was a man named Brandon Andrew Clark, and friends and internet acquaintances immediately recognized the girl as Bianca Michelle Devins.
This week's case takes us on a journey through every parents worst nightmare. We've said it before and we'll say it again, the internet is a scary place.
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48 hours episode
Rolling Stone "17 year old girl was murdered. How did photos of her death go viral?"
* no more links this week. We don't want to inadvertently lead you to traumatic photos that do not belong online.
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Wednesday Jan 11, 2023
Hopelessly Devoted (The murder of Dr. Joseph Sonnier)
Wednesday Jan 11, 2023
Wednesday Jan 11, 2023
It's a Leslie-sode!!! Happy New Years and welcome back after our little holiday break. We have a case filled with twists and turns. So settle in, because it's going to be a wild ride.
Dr. Joseph Sonnier was a well respected pathologist from Lubbock, Texas who was found shot and stabbed in his home on July 11th, 2012. Investigators quickly theorized this had not been a robbery gone wrong, but a personal attack. But who would want the doctor dead and why? With a list of family and friends to talk to, investigators were left with more questions than answers. Someone had to know something, and luckily someone did...
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Inside Texas Doctor’s Plot to Kill Rival Doctor in Love Triangle
Day Twelve: Thomas Dixon Murder Trial, Sonnier autopsy results revealed
Where Is Ex-Plastic Surgeon Dr. Thomas Michael Dixon Now?
Dateline NBC: Lone Star Obssession
The Murder Project
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About Us
We are Holly & Leslie, the hosts of We Would Be Dead. A weekly true crime podcast that finds humanity in the darkness, humor in the history, and the devil in the details. Above all else we recognize that if we had to walk a mile in any of the stories that we tell, we would be dead.